Facebook Thread about Our Schools and Teachers need help!
Posted Sunday, November 15, 2009 09:27 AM

Here is the facebook comments on this subject.  It sure hit some nerves.  For the most part our generation was a 2 parent family enviroment.  Todays generation is not that way, in fact the gang culture might be supplying the social needs our families once provided.

I think this is our country's most important issue to solve.

 

 
Carl J Winkler My wife is a 2nd grade teacher. Yesterday a 3rd grader was removed in handcuffs by police, it's happened before, this was the first I had heard about it. How did we lose the control in some of our schools, Schools should not have to deal situations like this and How do we correct this situation?
If you recognize the school system, please don't mention it in facebook.
A 3rd grader removed in handcuffs? Obviously someone isn't getting any discipline at home... When I was growing up, if you acted up in school you got a paddling at school and then another one when you got home. Parents need to go back to being parents instead of their kid's "friend".
AMEN!
It doesn't matter what school system, they all have the same problems!!!!! I think it all started when it wasn't ok to spank your children anymore. Discipline has to start at home and our stupid system has taken most of that away!
Parents don't parent anymore. Has nothing to do with schools.
When I got paddled at school I wouldn't have told my Dad because he would have let me have it ten times worse! Now parents go see a lawyer. We need to teach respect and self responsibility and be able to back it up with discipline.
Rodney they told our parents if they paddled us... you and I got nailed by our fathers too, at least once maybe me twice, you were generally better behaved than me.
Carl misbehaving? I can't imagine that... lol
We haven't lost control in our schools; maybe classrooms, with various classroom rules and regulations-each teacher enforces school policy and then the classroom usually has its own rules-depend on the teacher, personality/relationship with the child. Children make choices, sometimes poor choices, and then the consequences are administered. Our... Read More schools lately are like prisons for our children-research the Montessori school system, and the various charter schools-these schools excell in instruction and curriculum. As a former teacher and Ed.D (ABD), I can honestly say the problem lies at home without parental involvement, (not the childs'), classroom strategies and even the curriculum of some teachers (boring and hasn't been changed in three decades), and little child/teacher relationship building. As a teacher and current mental health case manager, I believe the school system needs an over haul-I do not believe in tenure (3 yrs of service), and that all teachers and administrators be held accountable for the level of learning of their students. NCLB has been good in the long run for some schools. It is a multitude of variables that has developed over the course of the last decade where our educational system has failed to provide quality education for all students. You must look at the child, the teacher, the parent, the environment, the mental health status of the child and teachers, peers, media, home life, etc. It is NOT about spanking or paddling, or fear: it IS about learning, and activating that child to be better, performs well, and achieve the most out of life. I could go on and on........
Our parents use to give us what is called an attitude adjustment. I don't know how involved they were but I knew if I didn't show respect or if I made excuses instead of being responsible I would be in line for an attitude adjustment! :)
And punishment
Absolutely... Thank you Marylou for providing an appropriate educational environment for children, but the fact remains that the current generation of children lacks the respect for their elders that our generation had. "Time outs" are a ridiculous waste of time. Discipline starts very early. I didn't abuse my kids but I loved them every day ... Read Moreand I spanked them when they needed it. They knew not to push their luck with me or their mother. They were raised to show respect for ALL adults and on occasion when they forgot that, they were promptly reminded. Today I have two intelligent, polite, respectful, and productive teenage girls who are well on their way to being productive adults. I see some of their friends who have loving parents but no discipline at home and I am SO glad that my girls don't behave the way these other kids do. And acting up in school to the extent that the police department has to be called? If that doesn't indicate a lack of discipline, I don't know what does. I spent 16 years in a police car dealing with people who weren't taught any respect at home. I got very tired of having to bring some discipline in to a home when the parents were too weak to do it themselves. Bring back corporal punishment!!!!
Boy did I hit a nerve with this one.

Mary Lou you had great comments but such comments do not apply to a kid who needs police and handcuffs to get him out of the school.

New tid bit a year ago one of my wife’s best teacher friends was struck in the head with a stone on the play ground, not a big injury. She was attempting to administer discipline by making the child stand by a post instead of play time. ... Read more

had that happened to my wife I might have looked that kid and his family up. Andy Dittmaier you should go with me for muscle. It's time to empower the schools and everything should be considered.
"...the use of corporal punishment in schools is intrinsically related to child maltreatment. It contributes to a climate of violence, it implies that society approves of the physical violation of children, it establishes an unhealthy norm...Its outright abolition throughout the nation must occur immediately." - U.S. Advisory Board on Child Abuse ... Read Moreand Neglect, 1991-SEP-15
"The fundamental need of American education is to find ways of engaging today's children in the thrill of learning. Fear of pain has no place in that process." The Christian Science Monitor, 1989-MAR-21
Spanking a child will stop the child from misbehaving for the moment, but studies have shown that the child's compliance will only last for a short time; corporal punishment actually increases the child's non-compliant behavior in the future. Psychologist H. Stephen Glenn said "Corporal punishment is the least effective method [of discipline]. ... Read More Punishment reinforces a failure identity. It reinforces rebellion, resistance, revenge and resentment. And, what people who spank children will learn is that it teaches more about you than it does about them that the whole goal is to crush the child. It's not dignified, and it's not respectful."
It trains a child to use violence: Spanking can teach children that it is acceptable for the strong to use force against the weak -- the concept "Might makes right" is regularly reinforced. They have an increased likelihood of becoming more aggressive towards their siblings, their fellow students, and (later in life) against their spouses and their... Read More own children. Violence as a way of behaving is a learned response.(religioustolerance.org).Spanking lowers a child's IQ: A study at the University of New Hampshire, released in 1998-JUL, found that spanking children apparently slows down their intellectual development. A study of 960 children found an average 4 point reduction in IQ among students, from and average IQ of 102 (above average) for children who are not spanked, to an average IQ 98 (below average) for who are. A reduction of 4 points is enough to have a significant negative functional effect on the students. Ms. Dawn Walker, executive director of the Canadian Institute of Child Health commented:

"We know that children who are under the threat of violence or aggression develop a fight-or-flight response system that has an impact on creativity and imagination, both of which could influence their IQ...Children need discipline but not hitting." 3
I don't remember our schools being anything like what they are today? We had corporal punishment? It may be the least effective but it didn't cause violence! I respect your opinion though! I think poor parenting, the courts and Hollywood has made a big impact on children's behavior in school.
Violence and punishment are two different things. And those studies sound about as reliable as a global warming study dines by the al gore institute for the enrichment of al gore.
Carl just never got caught, mark and I were the dummies, Andy! I really think that spanking a child has its time and place, it's not always the best solution, depends on the situation. I know that my backhand worked great at times, ask my sons and I think they will agree... Eamon, Erich you in on this????
Oh and hi rodney, you remember the little brat sis??
Hi Betsy! I do remember you but you were a lot younger than us. I didn't think you were a brat but your brothers probably thought so. Ha! :) Thanks for saying Hi, have a good weekend!
You too rodney, 7 years is nothing now though
MaryLou must have been at a suburban school. In so many schools there is no environment for learning due solely to a lack of discipline. In a nutshell, paddling (or the threat of it) is merely a part of the equation. It worked when I was in school and my parents didn't sue the school. If they had, the case would have been tossed, unlike today.
Right on Brent and Carl!
 
 
 
 
 
Mary Lou’s comments.
 
We haven't lost control in our schools; maybe classrooms, with various classroom rules and regulations-each teacher enforces school policy and then the classroom usually has its own rules-depend on the teacher, personality/relationship with the child. Children make choices, sometimes poor choices, and then the consequences are administered. Our... Read More schools lately are like prisons for our children-research the Montessori school system, and the various charter schools-these schools excell in instruction and curriculum. As a former teacher and Ed.D (ABD), I can honestly say the problem lies at home without parental involvement, (not the childs'), classroom strategies and even the curriculum of some teachers (boring and hasn't been changed in three decades), and little child/teacher relationship building. As a teacher and current mental health case manager, I believe the school system needs an over haul-I do not believe in tenure (3 yrs of service), and that all teachers and administrators be held accountable for the level of learning of their students. NCLB has been good in the long run for some schools. It is a multitude of variables that has developed over the course of the last decade where our educational system has failed to provide quality education for all students. You must look at the child, the teacher, the parent, the environment, the mental health status of the child and teachers, peers, media, home life, etc. It is NOT about spanking or paddling, or fear: it IS about learning, and activating that child to be better, performs well, and achieve the most out of life. I could go on and on........
"...the use of corporal punishment in schools is intrinsically related to child maltreatment. It contributes to a climate of violence, it implies that society approves of the physical violation of children, it establishes an unhealthy norm...Its outright abolition throughout the nation must occur immediately." - U.S. Advisory Board on Child Abuse ... Read Moreand Neglect, 1991-SEP-15
"The fundamental need of American education is to find ways of engaging today's children in the thrill of learning. Fear of pain has no place in that process." The Christian Science Monitor, 1989-MAR-21
 
Spanking a child will stop the child from misbehaving for the moment, but studies have shown that the child's compliance will only last for a short time; corporal punishment actually increases the child's non-compliant behavior in the future. Psychologist H. Stephen Glenn said "Corporal punishment is the least effective method [of discipline]. ... Read More Punishment reinforces a failure identity. It reinforces rebellion, resistance, revenge and resentment. And, what people who spank children will learn is that it teaches more about you than it does about them that the whole goal is to crush the child. It's not dignified, and it's not respectful
It trains a child to use violence: Spanking can teach children that it is acceptable for the strong to use force against the weak -- the concept "Might makes right" is regularly reinforced. They have an increased likelihood of becoming more aggressive towards their siblings, their fellow students, and (later in life) against their spouses and their... Read More own children. Violence as a way of behaving is a learned response.(religioustolerance.org).Spanking lowers a child's IQ: A study at the University of New Hampshire, released in 1998-JUL, found that spanking children apparently slows down their intellectual development. A study of 960 children found an average 4 point reduction in IQ among students, from and average IQ of 102 (above average) for children who are not spanked, to an average IQ 98 (below average) for who are. A reduction of 4 points is enough to have a significant negative functional effect on the students. Ms. Dawn Walker, executive director of the Canadian Institute of Child Health commented:

"We know that children who are under the threat of violence or aggression develop a fight-or-flight response system that has an impact on creativity and imagination, both of which could influence their IQ...Children need discipline but not hitting."
 

Carl "Wink" Winkler